Looking at an F25

[PNWAlan]

Hello to all from the Great Pacific Northwest. I may have the opportunity/misfortune to obtain a '73 F25 for a song. I have been reading forum pages here for the past few days to get an idea of what I may be getting into. What a helpful,generous bunch of mariners you have here! Also called Bob today to get some help deciphering the ID number on the transom. Geeze, seemed like the good ol' days when business people were genuinely knowledgable and helpful. He not only translated the ID number, but pointed out known problem points to look for in my evaluation of the boat.

The F25 will be at auction, so I will only have an hour inspection period to make the go/no go decision. Can't get it surveyed or even run the engine. It is in the dry stack storage marina where I keep my present boat. The boat is in "covered" storage, but it is roof only. Open on all sides. It's a little rough looking, but with the gravel driveways by the storage sheds and a couple of dust and dirt producing businesses nearby I know my boat looks almost as bad if I let her go a month without getting down to wash her off.

I am going into this with my eyes wide open. I researched prices on F25s from immaculate restorations to "good" condition boats. The running gear, (prop and rudder) look great, but without being able to run the engine I will have to figure the cost of major engine work into what I am willing to pay for her. I will get a chance to see the engine and general condition of through hulls, etc during the inspection and that should give me some clue as to how she was maintained before the PO took ill and quit using her.

Bob cautioned me to check the decks, both cockpit sole and foredeck over and around the V berth, for soft spots. Will also look for signs of leaks under the fore deck and around the hull/deck joint. I have quite a bit of marine electrical experience, so should be able to do a good evaluation on wiring. Are there any other problem areas either peculiar to the F25 or Trojans in general that I should be aware of? Thanks in advance for any input.

Alan

[prowlersfish]

Sounds like you got it covered . Remember boats taken for money owed be it storage or loans normally are not the best take care of . Will they Let you even check to see if it turns over ? Even using a wrench ? let us know how it turns out .

[Paul - SW Ontario]

It will almost certainly have soft spots....anchor plates on fore deck, hause pipe for anchor rode, cabin roof forward around port and starboard handle points where fastened to name a few. Don't expect perfection....they are repairable within reason.

The old Trojan style railings are week and frumpy....don't be alarmed if they move around a bit.

If it is original teak cockpit sole....with a strong flashlight look under port and starboard sole at the support framing closest to the hull sides...known for years of water intrusion there and the sole supports along the hull rot. Repairable but time consuming.

Should be able to grab belt for Altenator, water pump and crank...and get the motor to turn.
Pull the engine dipstick, check for muddy brown oil....sign of water intrusion.
Pull the velvet drive dipstick, check for muddy ATF fluid....again water intrusion. should be nice red colour.

Turn prop and shaft by hand...check for any noticable bends in each.
You should be able to move the rudder back and forth by hand as well, to see if the steering is free, and the rudder post is not bent.
Lift and pull the teak cover out from beneath the helm....check to see if the steering has been updated to a Teleflex style cable. Look at the old fuse panel for rust etc.

Check for trim tabs...these are a must for these F25's. A plus if it has them.

Those of us who own them, love or hate them....depends on your expectations.
After 12 years of ownership, I still love mine....the hulls are likely the strongest ever built in this size boat.

Good luck.
Paul

[PNWAlan]

I am outfitting an inspection tool kit and will dive into her as much as possible in the hour I will have for inspection. Certainly not going to get in a bidding war if there are any boat flippers attending. Will only pull the trigger if I can lowball a bid and think I can get her out on the water using only my "amusement" budget. I don't have any emotional commitment to buy, but I sure do like her lines and really do want a bit larger boat than the 17 footer I have now.

Thanks for the great tips Paul. I am going to compile and print out a checklist using your tips and the pointers I got from Bob yesterday.

Wish me luck
Alan

[PNWAlan]

I stay on pretty good terms with the marina staff so was allowed a "pre-inspection inspection" today. Found some good, some bad, and some ugly!



The good:Overall the hull and topsides are in remarkably good shape for her age and the fact her last registration sticker is 2011. You can't tell from the pic, but underneath all the grime the gel coat has a pretty good shine.The teak rubrail is intact except for a pinky sized chip missing from the end of one piece. The stainless rubrail cap has only one 2-3" section that may not be able to be formed and polished back to original condition. I didn't tap it out, but there was no bounce or soft spots in the deck that I could feel. There is some evidence of a few "healthy" dock bumps around the foredeck. A couple spots with spiderweb cracks and one area that looks like it was "repaired" with MarineTex.

The bad: Every piece of window glass around the helm is cracked, so all would have to be replaced. The windscreen frame is so-so.. probably would need to be stripped and painted or powder coated. There are snaps and brackets around the cockpit but no frames or canvas to be found anywhere on the boat.



OK..don't snort your drink!! Out here on the west cost every boat has a kicker bracket!! Again a little hard to see, but the rudder and prop are either new or refurbished. Spotless. I assume those are aftermarket swim steps? The taffrail is in real good shape. Could fairly easily be brought back to it's former glory.



The teak at the helm looks to be restorable. Hasn't received much TLC lately, but I think it can be saved. The seats are down below and look to be in good shape.

OK.. get ready for the UGLY!!



If I had seen this before I read a hundred and fifty or so pages of this forum I would have scrambled back down the ladder and run away. I have seen a couple of threads that lead me to believe that replacing the whole cockpit sole (framing and all) is not an insurmountable task. I was a pretty good carpenter in a former life and have done a bit of work with epoxy and glass mat. What do you experts think? Can it be saved? I would like to salvage the teak planking but that may be asking too much. Would love to have the teak deck.. but marine plywood, glass mat, epoxy, and nonskid paint or gelcoat may be the more practical solution.

Forgot to take pics of the engine compartment and down below.

The engine is FWC so that is a big plus. I was thinking I might need a long block, but then the price of a new FWC system is as much or more than that so that would be taking me into putting way more into her than I would want to do. Engine and trans oil showed no signs of water. I didn't have time or tools to try and turn the engine over. A couple of the staff told me they thought she had a new/reman engine but it sure didn't look like it. It has an Edelbrock carb. One of the staff dropped by while I was looking and told me he thought it was an automotive carb. If so that would have to be changed. Overall the engine compartment was not pristine, but no waving red flags either.

Down below she looked OK. Most importantly showed no signs of leaking around the foredeck hatch nor around the deck/hull joint. The deck is carpet over plywood so I assume that was changed out at some time. Didn't see a table. Did the 25s come with one?

Right now I am thinking she could be resurrected. Just not sure about the cockpit sole. Welcome your opinions.

Alan

[AlphaJustin]

What are you using it for? Because if you aren't looking for a show boat just something to fish from or go out with friends and family there's a bunch of you tube videos showing how to re-caulk the teak floor the rest except that strange cut out under the driver seat? That's not factory I'd make sure it has a backing or braces. It's going to take some serious work but the floor is salvageable.
Yes the 25 does have a table and under the port side v coushion is a storage compartment that should have a cushion in it that goes on the table to convert to a bed if it wasn't pouring rain I would take a few pics of mine so you can see what they looked like originally mine is untouched (it's so tacky i love it)
For the snaps along the windshield I think those are factory you would know if it had the canvas with it, it's very large and bulky I'll bet the previous owner took it home and has it in his basement if you get the boat I would try to track them down see if they will sell it to you they probably fell on hard times and need the money.
That steering wheel of all things was what flew out of the picture and smacked my turn off button it's terrible looking replace it! HAHA
Visually not bad though if it goes for around 1000 or less and you have ample time, space, and project money it would probably be worth it in my oppinion.
Side note insurance values the boat at around 3000 so you need an agreed value policy also just a heads up that will cost a few more bucks every year.

[AlphaJustin]

1972 green interior I'm sure they had a name for it but this is everything the filler piece for the v is in the port side storage compartment also btw I just don't need it so it stays away. Also the wallpaper has seen better days in the v and in the bathroom and i did reseal that port window that you can see leaked and stained the back rest. Im too judgmental of my boat its old flaws are natural is what I keep reminding myself.

[PNWAlan]

Thanks for the input and the pics.

Man, I debated pros and cons all night long. And then again this morning after seeing the posts above. Finally, after all that soul searching, decided there were just too many "no" votes. Don't have a place to keep her during refirb, so would be paying storage on two boats until I could get her seaworthy and sell my present boat. I have the capability, but not sure the fire in my gut to tackle that deck. Lots of other factors, but those are the big ones.

I was down at the marina at auction time but didn't go to watch. Still had the cash on me that I pulled to be ready for the sale so didn't want to have to fight off the temptation. So I don't know what she went for.

Not a lot of Trojans around here, a few. But I do remember admiring them during my youth on Lake Erie. I don't think anybody with a hint of saltwater in their veins could help but love those lines. I am going to keep lurking around here and keep looking. Who knows, an F boat(25,26,28) in better shape may show up. I may yet join the Trojan Family.

Thanks to all who advised and thanks to all the contributors to the forum.

Alan

[oil&water]

As one who is / has tackled the deck and framing, it was not hard. Mine was way worse than this one. It is a two weekend project if you put some pre-planning into the design. The teak was probably salvageable. For those looking to perform a restoration, keep in mind that the strips are only about a 1/4 to 3/8" thick. The rest of the deck is plywood underneath.

I know these gut wrench decisions are hard. I had them on mine, and frankly still do as we move through the refurb process. Now if the 100 degree days would move on, I could get back on mine.

[PNWAlan]

I'm sure you guys are right that the deck would not have been as overwhelming as I thought. In fact I have been kickin' myself in the butt for the past two days for chickenin' out. Getting much too timid in my old age I guess .

Oh well, the search goes on.

Alan

[The Dog House]

I'm sure you guys are right that the deck would not have been as overwhelming as I thought. In fact I have been kickin' myself in the butt for the past two days for chickenin' out. Getting much too timid in my old age I guess .

If your gut told you not to do it then the right thing to do is not to do it. There are plenty of F25/F26 Trojans available to choose from. Take your time and find the right one for you.

[PNWAlan]

She showed up on Craigslist this AM for $3800. Looks like the flipper threw some kind of finish on the deck, took some pics, and posted the listing.

[AlphaJustin]

Actually after looking at the sea-tac Craigslist you guys have ridiculous boat prices anyway so he may be ok in price even with the problems there's a mint 1984 32 fly bridge for sale near me for 7500 just as an example of the value difference of boats. Sorry.

[PNWAlan]

The old "built like a tank" boats do command a premium price around here. I'm planning on selling my 1990 17' Arima to pay for a J25/26 with enough leftover to cover any repairs and outfitting to get it on the water. Glasplys were built just down the road from me and you still see those old girls everywhere you look. Those hulls are just reaching puberty at 30 yrs. I would be looking for a Glasply except that almost everthing under 30' were I/Os. I just don't like the "doghouse" taking up deck space with an I/O, plus the huge hole in the transom for the big bellows on the older model stern drives.

I think I am going to have to expand my search area. Putting up a new post to try to find dimensions and weights to see what shipping costs might be.

[oldboat1]

Kicker rig here as well, on mine anyway (slow trolling for lakers):

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I was looking at a Tollycraft some time ago (Maryland) that was a donation sale -- passed on it, and felt a little sorry I did. I had seem them in Seattle in my Dawg days, and like the layouts. Just for grins, found a 26' at Shilshole Bay: http://wrightyachtsales.com/1977-tollycraft-26/

Good luck in the search (looking is at least half the fun).