My Boyfriend and I just purchased a 1974 Trojan F32 Sedan. We found some rotted stringers after we purchased the boat. Now we are stuck with a huge bill to replace the stringers (hopefully with a healthy contribution from the marina that we bought it from) that has yet to be determined.
1) If you had to have the stringers replaced on your vessel, how much did it cost?
2) Is it possible to do it ourselves?
3) Is there a lemon law on Boats in New York State?
Thank you in advance !!
Beachouse
stringers replaced??
Moderators: BeaconMarineBob, Moderator, BeaconMarineDon
Stringers
First, congratulations on your purchase. F-32's are really nice boats, however since the boat is as old as it is long, your sure to find things that need repair or updating and personalizing.
Second, any lemon laws that I'm aware of involving used boats have to do with how big a slice to put in your drink.
Third, a stringer repair is not an unusual thing to have to do on boats even half the age of this one. And yes, it is a repair that you can probably do your selves if your comfortable doing basic woodworking. The fiberglass part is easy to learn. There are books and videos available on the subject. You'll also find that people on this web site have years of experience working on these boats and can help with any questions that you may have.
Tell us a little about the boat (condition, power) and where the rot is on which stringer.
Hope this helps
Paul
Cruise Control
Second, any lemon laws that I'm aware of involving used boats have to do with how big a slice to put in your drink.
Third, a stringer repair is not an unusual thing to have to do on boats even half the age of this one. And yes, it is a repair that you can probably do your selves if your comfortable doing basic woodworking. The fiberglass part is easy to learn. There are books and videos available on the subject. You'll also find that people on this web site have years of experience working on these boats and can help with any questions that you may have.
Tell us a little about the boat (condition, power) and where the rot is on which stringer.
Hope this helps
Paul
Cruise Control
here is a good reference: Order from West Systems or most local marine supply retailer that carry West Systems products
002-550 Fiberglass Boat Repair & Maintenance
Softcover-84 pages.
A complete, illustrated guide to most fiberglass boat repair problems. Includes detailed instructions on repairing rotted stringers and frames, delamination, keel damage. Also covers fairing keels, hardware bonding, finishing and installing teak veneers.
One of the best expressions for new boat buyers to keep in mind that I've seen recently is from an article on YachtSurvey.com
Good Luck,
Chuck
002-550 Fiberglass Boat Repair & Maintenance
Softcover-84 pages.
A complete, illustrated guide to most fiberglass boat repair problems. Includes detailed instructions on repairing rotted stringers and frames, delamination, keel damage. Also covers fairing keels, hardware bonding, finishing and installing teak veneers.
One of the best expressions for new boat buyers to keep in mind that I've seen recently is from an article on YachtSurvey.com
Speaking from experience, my advice is before you start ripping things apart, try to get a handle on the full scope of the project. Engines, fuel tank, wiring, etc. If its way beyond what you want to tackle, you might decide to cut your loss before throwing more good money after bad.the Cost is More Than Just the Price.
Good Luck,
Chuck
formerly
Lots A Luck
Trojan F-26 Express
Narragansett Bay, RI
Lots A Luck
Trojan F-26 Express
Narragansett Bay, RI
stringers replaced??
Well I thought it would be a good idea to update you all on our 1974 Trojan F-32 that my boyfriend and I bought last fall. We had an issue with the soft stringers on the boat and have since worked out an aggreement with the sellers to have the stringers injected with the liquid laminate (forgot what it's called).
Has anyone performed this task themselves?
The dealer is having a fiberglass repair expert do the work. We're just a little concerned because the stringers were really soft and saturated with moisture. The boat has been stored (shrink-wrapped) outside all winter. We kept the floor boards out and did our best to dry out the boat as much as we could.
So far the repair dude is planning to drill a hole on the top of the stringers that is rotted, every 6 inches and filling it with the epoxy. Does that sound about right?
Any input would be appreciated.
We love our boat and pray for many years of safe boating!!!!!!!!
Thank you in advance !!!!
Has anyone performed this task themselves?
The dealer is having a fiberglass repair expert do the work. We're just a little concerned because the stringers were really soft and saturated with moisture. The boat has been stored (shrink-wrapped) outside all winter. We kept the floor boards out and did our best to dry out the boat as much as we could.
So far the repair dude is planning to drill a hole on the top of the stringers that is rotted, every 6 inches and filling it with the epoxy. Does that sound about right?
Any input would be appreciated.
We love our boat and pray for many years of safe boating!!!!!!!!
Thank you in advance !!!!
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JuiceClark
- Moderate User
- Posts: 388
- Joined: Tue May 02, 2006 10:20 am
- Location: Fort Myers, FL
bummer
I'm so sorry you had that stringer problem. I have a 1981 F-36 and the stringers look like they were made yesterday. However, I did repair (not replace) the stringers in a previous boat.
Are the entire stringers rotten? That would be hard to imagine. But if the bilge was wet long enough to rot them in entirety, I would insist you have them replaced. Squirting resin in there every six inches, in that extreme case, would be worthless. Hell, the whole point of a Trojan is the rock solid hull!
If there are only rotted spots in the engine compartment or back under the cockpit, it's pretty easy to fix. I just cut the tops off the stringers on my former boat, dug all the rotten crap outta' there with a sawzall and crowbar and replaced it with heavily epoxied marine plywood layers...then glassed back over the top.
One last thing, where there was rot the hull was weakened...maybe. So, check underneath the hull as well to see if there was any flexing. This would be evident as little spider vein looking cracks around the weak area.
The hull on that boat is built well though. Even if you had NO stringers at all, it would probably be stronger than most of the new crap on the market.
Tony
Fort Myers, FL
Are the entire stringers rotten? That would be hard to imagine. But if the bilge was wet long enough to rot them in entirety, I would insist you have them replaced. Squirting resin in there every six inches, in that extreme case, would be worthless. Hell, the whole point of a Trojan is the rock solid hull!
If there are only rotted spots in the engine compartment or back under the cockpit, it's pretty easy to fix. I just cut the tops off the stringers on my former boat, dug all the rotten crap outta' there with a sawzall and crowbar and replaced it with heavily epoxied marine plywood layers...then glassed back over the top.
One last thing, where there was rot the hull was weakened...maybe. So, check underneath the hull as well to see if there was any flexing. This would be evident as little spider vein looking cracks around the weak area.
The hull on that boat is built well though. Even if you had NO stringers at all, it would probably be stronger than most of the new crap on the market.
Tony
Fort Myers, FL
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prowlersfish
- 2024 Gold Support
- Posts: 12675
- Joined: Sat Nov 05, 2005 6:56 pm
- Location: Lower Chesapeake Bay ,Va
Beachouse , I have to agree with JuiceClark just how bad are the stringers ? this "get-rot" type fix maybe fine for small places . but lagre parts of stringers ? can you email some photos ? has the glass guy every done anything like this ?
Paul
prowlersfish@yahoo.com
Paul
prowlersfish@yahoo.com
Boating is good for the soul
77/78 TROJAN F36 Conv.
6BTA Cummins diesels
Life is to short for a ugly boat
77/78 TROJAN F36 Conv.
6BTA Cummins diesels
Life is to short for a ugly boat
stringers replaced??
Thank you for your prompt responses.
The stringers which are rotted are 5 transverse stringers running from just after the v birth to the companion way stairs.
The extent of the rot seems to be about 12inches either side of center line.
for a a total of 24inches per stringer.
It seems that the rot started at the scuppers which are on center due to the water lying there and over the years the rot worked it's way outboard.
Right at the scupper hole the wood is quite soft, and rotten. However it is not as bad moving outboard from the center line.
Further away from the center line the wood seems good.
We have taken core samples in order to determine the extent of the rot.
The longitudinal stringers at the transom also show rot running approx 12 inches forward from the stern.
At this point we don't have photos. If it would help we would try to take them for you.
Over all the boat is in excellent shape and shows that it had been given good care all along. We think that some where along the line one of her owners didn't check the bilge for accumulated water and this caused the rot.
It looks like the attention was spent waxing the hull and varnishing the wood, but not checking under the floor boards.
Allen and Linda
P.S. We are both so happy to not only own a Trojan, but to also have such a great group of people helping us in this forum.
The stringers which are rotted are 5 transverse stringers running from just after the v birth to the companion way stairs.
The extent of the rot seems to be about 12inches either side of center line.
for a a total of 24inches per stringer.
It seems that the rot started at the scuppers which are on center due to the water lying there and over the years the rot worked it's way outboard.
Right at the scupper hole the wood is quite soft, and rotten. However it is not as bad moving outboard from the center line.
Further away from the center line the wood seems good.
We have taken core samples in order to determine the extent of the rot.
The longitudinal stringers at the transom also show rot running approx 12 inches forward from the stern.
At this point we don't have photos. If it would help we would try to take them for you.
Over all the boat is in excellent shape and shows that it had been given good care all along. We think that some where along the line one of her owners didn't check the bilge for accumulated water and this caused the rot.
It looks like the attention was spent waxing the hull and varnishing the wood, but not checking under the floor boards.
Allen and Linda
P.S. We are both so happy to not only own a Trojan, but to also have such a great group of people helping us in this forum.
-
prowlersfish
- 2024 Gold Support
- Posts: 12675
- Joined: Sat Nov 05, 2005 6:56 pm
- Location: Lower Chesapeake Bay ,Va
Beachouse first of all its good to know your not talking about the longitudinal stringers being completely rotted I thought tins was the case
(I think Juiceclark thought so to ) the stringers you are talking about should be a easer fix ( I don't think stringers is the correct name) do it like Juiceclark said in his post if one was hard to get to the epoxy fix may be ok but the wood needs to be dry not wet
but not as good as replacing it . you could always sister one in you you have to but will stick out when it comes time to sell . I don;t think these are as critical as the" longitudinal stringers" but still inportant and very inportant in the engroom as they will keep the enging stringers (or longitudinal stringers ) trying to flex or move to the sides from the force of the engines . if you can get get me photos it would be good so I can be sure we are talking about the same thing
Juiceclark are we on the same page ?? what are your thoughts ?
Paul
(I think Juiceclark thought so to ) the stringers you are talking about should be a easer fix ( I don't think stringers is the correct name) do it like Juiceclark said in his post if one was hard to get to the epoxy fix may be ok but the wood needs to be dry not wet
but not as good as replacing it . you could always sister one in you you have to but will stick out when it comes time to sell . I don;t think these are as critical as the" longitudinal stringers" but still inportant and very inportant in the engroom as they will keep the enging stringers (or longitudinal stringers ) trying to flex or move to the sides from the force of the engines . if you can get get me photos it would be good so I can be sure we are talking about the same thing
Juiceclark are we on the same page ?? what are your thoughts ?
Paul
Boating is good for the soul
77/78 TROJAN F36 Conv.
6BTA Cummins diesels
Life is to short for a ugly boat
77/78 TROJAN F36 Conv.
6BTA Cummins diesels
Life is to short for a ugly boat
-
JuiceClark
- Moderate User
- Posts: 388
- Joined: Tue May 02, 2006 10:20 am
- Location: Fort Myers, FL
Yeah...piece of cake
Right Paul,
I know those lateral stringers well. That's not too bad a repair. Without seeing it I wouldn't venture to guess at what a yard will charge...but it will be something like $300 per foot they have to dig-out and replace. Hacking away at rotted wood is a crappy, messy job...but it's a fairly easy job if you're up for it.
To be slightly more precise from what I mentioned above: I cut the top off the rotten stringer. Then I drilled a couple holes on each side of the rot - including about 6 inches of good wood on each side. Then I took the Sawzall and made about 10 running cuts between the two holes until the old stringer was sliced to bits. Then I scraped and pryed and sweated until all the old crappy wood, and good wood, was out between the holes. Leave the ends at some sort of angle so the new gradually ends into the old.
Buy the thinnest marine plywood you can find and cut it into a pieces that will fit tightly in the opening. You'll need 3 or 4 the same size to be wide enough to replace the stringer. Get some West System Epoxy and pour it in there and stick in the first piece. Stick the other pieces in there and pour that stuff around it so it's solid. That won't rot again!
If there are any large, open areas around the plywood additions, mix a bunch of sawdust with the West System before you pour it in. When it's dry, fiberglass a couple layers over the top...overlapping the area to share strength with the big, long-ways stringers.
Ta-da!! Then take the $2,000 you probably saved and buy a good stock with a high dividend yield.
Tony
I know those lateral stringers well. That's not too bad a repair. Without seeing it I wouldn't venture to guess at what a yard will charge...but it will be something like $300 per foot they have to dig-out and replace. Hacking away at rotted wood is a crappy, messy job...but it's a fairly easy job if you're up for it.
To be slightly more precise from what I mentioned above: I cut the top off the rotten stringer. Then I drilled a couple holes on each side of the rot - including about 6 inches of good wood on each side. Then I took the Sawzall and made about 10 running cuts between the two holes until the old stringer was sliced to bits. Then I scraped and pryed and sweated until all the old crappy wood, and good wood, was out between the holes. Leave the ends at some sort of angle so the new gradually ends into the old.
Buy the thinnest marine plywood you can find and cut it into a pieces that will fit tightly in the opening. You'll need 3 or 4 the same size to be wide enough to replace the stringer. Get some West System Epoxy and pour it in there and stick in the first piece. Stick the other pieces in there and pour that stuff around it so it's solid. That won't rot again!
If there are any large, open areas around the plywood additions, mix a bunch of sawdust with the West System before you pour it in. When it's dry, fiberglass a couple layers over the top...overlapping the area to share strength with the big, long-ways stringers.
Ta-da!! Then take the $2,000 you probably saved and buy a good stock with a high dividend yield.
Tony
stringers replaced??
Thanks for all your suggestions. I would like to send you pictures. Are there any specific photo angles that you want to see? It is finely getting a little warmer here in the North East so I may be able to take some photos this week.
Thanks for your patience. We really are trying to get the right fix from the begining- if possible!!!
Linda and Allen
Thanks for your patience. We really are trying to get the right fix from the begining- if possible!!!
Linda and Allen
-
prowlersfish
- 2024 Gold Support
- Posts: 12675
- Joined: Sat Nov 05, 2005 6:56 pm
- Location: Lower Chesapeake Bay ,Va
Linda, Allen,
I would love to see pictures of your f32.
If you would like to post pictures then (i think) you need to post the pictures to a web album site (I used web shots) then view your album (or picture) and cut and paste the link to the forum text you are writing.
Currently this forum does not support direct uploads. (I think?)
Fred
(who apparently is thinking allot tonight)
I would love to see pictures of your f32.
If you would like to post pictures then (i think) you need to post the pictures to a web album site (I used web shots) then view your album (or picture) and cut and paste the link to the forum text you are writing.
Currently this forum does not support direct uploads. (I think?)
Fred
(who apparently is thinking allot tonight)
Stringer photos
Ok Folks here are the pics of our Trojan "Sea~lah"
(old name is still on the boat)
I hope the pic will help us decide the proper repair of the stringers.
http://s178.photobucket.com/albums/w260/Lindydindy/
This is a great Forum, and we thank all of you who have added to our current issue with our "Sea~lah"
Allen and Linda
(old name is still on the boat)
I hope the pic will help us decide the proper repair of the stringers.
http://s178.photobucket.com/albums/w260/Lindydindy/
This is a great Forum, and we thank all of you who have added to our current issue with our "Sea~lah"
Allen and Linda
Linda, Allen
Nice looking boat, I was thinking of doing my canvas over the back deck same as yours.
A quick question, was the boat professionally surveyed before your purchase?
After having the same kind of rot on my boat years later I realized it started well before I purchased it. After talking to the surveyor during purchase (supplied by the seller or salesman) about the fiberglass sitting higher than the wood on the stringer by the engine mounts (the stringers were sinking or compacting) he said it was because trojan wrapped the stringer and left a air gap between the top of the wood and glass. Now I know he was full of horse dunky and was acting on behalf of the seller. Unfortunatly it all came together in my head years later and now without proof, I am left replacing the stringers my self with no legal recourse.
If your surveyor missed somthing that big there should be some legal recourse?
Now for my recomendation. You can inject a resin into the rotted wood and this may work for a temporary fix (get you through the season or longer if you are sitting at the dock).
After tearing into replacing my stringers I realized two things. Its really not that bad just takes time, and a little research (and a good forum, like this one). Now I am glad I didnt fill the stringers up with resin because then I could not just cut the tops off the stringers and easily clean the rot out and have a empty form to drop the new stringers into. The new stringers are 2-1/2" wide so (2) pieces of 3/4 marine ply and (2) pieces of 1/2" fit perfectly.
So sorry for the harder recomendation but now even though I am in the middle of replacing stringers I am glad this is the path I chose. Also I did not get a quote on having them done but I will have around $500 to $700 in my repair job when I am all said an done, maybe a little more since I am putting a teak and holly floor down to replace the old carpet over ply.
Good luck, And sorry I would love to come and help with your project, but you would not be able to afford the fees my wife would charge for my services before our boat was finished
Fred
Nice looking boat, I was thinking of doing my canvas over the back deck same as yours.
A quick question, was the boat professionally surveyed before your purchase?
After having the same kind of rot on my boat years later I realized it started well before I purchased it. After talking to the surveyor during purchase (supplied by the seller or salesman) about the fiberglass sitting higher than the wood on the stringer by the engine mounts (the stringers were sinking or compacting) he said it was because trojan wrapped the stringer and left a air gap between the top of the wood and glass. Now I know he was full of horse dunky and was acting on behalf of the seller. Unfortunatly it all came together in my head years later and now without proof, I am left replacing the stringers my self with no legal recourse.
If your surveyor missed somthing that big there should be some legal recourse?
Now for my recomendation. You can inject a resin into the rotted wood and this may work for a temporary fix (get you through the season or longer if you are sitting at the dock).
After tearing into replacing my stringers I realized two things. Its really not that bad just takes time, and a little research (and a good forum, like this one). Now I am glad I didnt fill the stringers up with resin because then I could not just cut the tops off the stringers and easily clean the rot out and have a empty form to drop the new stringers into. The new stringers are 2-1/2" wide so (2) pieces of 3/4 marine ply and (2) pieces of 1/2" fit perfectly.
So sorry for the harder recomendation but now even though I am in the middle of replacing stringers I am glad this is the path I chose. Also I did not get a quote on having them done but I will have around $500 to $700 in my repair job when I am all said an done, maybe a little more since I am putting a teak and holly floor down to replace the old carpet over ply.
Good luck, And sorry I would love to come and help with your project, but you would not be able to afford the fees my wife would charge for my services before our boat was finished
Fred
stringers replaced??
Hi Fred,
Thanks for your advice on our stringer issue.
We did have the boat professionally surveyed. It was however, completed after we bought the boat. We needed a survey for insurance purposes.
The surveyor was the one who found the rotted stringers. He put his skrew driver through a few of them.
The marina has agreed to split the cost of repair (epoxy was the suggested repair method) with the original owner, who had traded this trojan, for a bigger boat, the marina and finally Allen and me.
After reading and learning from several sources I wonder if we are putting a band-aid on the problem. The quote for the repair will cost around $1200, split between three parties. If the cost for replacing the stringers, instead of repairing them with epoxy is about the same price ,then it's a no-brainer. Replace not repair !!!
Linda and Allen
Thanks for your advice on our stringer issue.
We did have the boat professionally surveyed. It was however, completed after we bought the boat. We needed a survey for insurance purposes.
The surveyor was the one who found the rotted stringers. He put his skrew driver through a few of them.
The marina has agreed to split the cost of repair (epoxy was the suggested repair method) with the original owner, who had traded this trojan, for a bigger boat, the marina and finally Allen and me.
After reading and learning from several sources I wonder if we are putting a band-aid on the problem. The quote for the repair will cost around $1200, split between three parties. If the cost for replacing the stringers, instead of repairing them with epoxy is about the same price ,then it's a no-brainer. Replace not repair !!!
Linda and Allen